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Post by The Mad Titan on Jun 7, 2015 0:49:09 GMT
But I'm not asking if most modders want credit for their work, I'm asking if modders are okay with a global attribution rule or would prefer to state their own. Let's say 60% of modders would not want their models used, even with credit, for rule34 works. Should this then become a global rule? Or should we leave it up to each individual modder? I was really hoping to become an active member and start posting some stuff soon; it's why I re-installed Windows and created that Bra model. All I'm saying is this current rule is off-putting to me, and I would likely not post my mods here as a result. I think more people might feel the same way, hence my request for a simple poll. I'm 100% certain there will be a number of people agreeing with you. But I'm not sure that 100% of people will agree with you. I know I haven't contributed yet, but I was hoping my voice would at least count for something. However, I'm beginning to think suggestions are not appreciated and I just have to either accept it as it is or leave, which would be a shame imho. EDIT: I still agree it was a good call to make at the time, but I also think it's not a good long-term solution. I also agree we're somewhat arguing past eachother, which is again why I suggested adding more voices into the mix. I'm sorry you feel this way. i agreed your suggestion to get rid of the permission to make a video part right... but im not going to make a poll for everything you suggest several reasons. you havent seen what issues this community had in the past. so you only say what you see, same goes for me. some modders wont care if others steal their mods. but there are many of us who value their time spent modding. how would you find if someone stole a mod if you never credit the modder? how do you knwo which mod is which person's ? this isnt only me. the french forum agrees with me here too. you can ask darksoku . |
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Post by Shenron on Jun 7, 2015 0:51:40 GMT
Xan, my main concern is this: The rule about attribution (creator credit + thread link) applies to everyone. For my mods, I would not require any attributon, especially for gameplay footage. Essentially, I wold release them as "CC0". However, this rule prevents that would apply to my mods as well.
My concrete suggestion is to ask if modders are okay with this. If 95% is, fine, so be it. But personally, I would prefer each modder to be able to set their own usage rules, as it's also their mod. This is also why I brought in the rule34 analogy; usage rules will undoubtedly vary between mod creators.
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Post by kirihum on Jun 7, 2015 0:54:25 GMT
I'm with Titan on this one.Modders deserve credit if you use their mod in a video.not like in the character screen but if you actually use that character in a fight OF COURSE YOU CREDIT THE MODDER!I don't even know how someone could think it's not a given to give credit!And if a mod is good enough to make a video with it you probably won't have any problems finding it.
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Post by The Mad Titan on Jun 7, 2015 0:56:37 GMT
Xan, my main concern is this: The rule about attribution (creator credit + thread link) applies to everyone. For my mods, I would not require any attributon, especially for gameplay footage. Essentially, I wold release them as "CC0". However, this rule prevents that would apply to my mods as well. My concrete suggestion is to ask if modders are okay with this. If 95% is, fine, so be it. But personally, I would prefer each modder to be able to set their own usage rules, as it's also their mod. This is also why I brought in the rule34 analogy; usage rules will undoubtedly vary between mod creators. its too complicated. if you want your mods to be not protected under it that is fine. there are some who think like that. But what you ask will make it too complicated and make youtubers and other modders confused too. because some people have trouble following basic instructions here. sad. but true. lol thats where having the global rule becomes an advantage. but like i said im gonna talk about removing the asking permission to use the mod in a video part. but if you do you will still have to credit the modder. this doesnt have to be a rule if everyone did it in the first place. |
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Post by Xan on Jun 7, 2015 0:56:59 GMT
The fact of letting each modders set his own rule IF THEY WANT is something me and the admins will consider. If a modder doesn't want his works attributed, that'ss his right . We will do an announcement after talking about it, and update the rules if needed
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Post by Shenron on Jun 7, 2015 1:04:21 GMT
Xan, my main concern is this: The rule about attribution (creator credit + thread link) applies to everyone. For my mods, I would not require any attributon, especially for gameplay footage. Essentially, I wold release them as "CC0". However, this rule prevents that would apply to my mods as well. My concrete suggestion is to ask if modders are okay with this. If 95% is, fine, so be it. But personally, I would prefer each modder to be able to set their own usage rules, as it's also their mod. This is also why I brought in the rule34 analogy; usage rules will undoubtedly vary between mod creators. its too complicated. if you want your mods to be not protected under it that is fine. there are some who think like that. But what you ask will make it too complicated and make youtubers and other modders confused too. because some people have trouble following basic instructions here. sad. but true. lol thats where having the global rule becomes an advantage. but like i said im gonna talk about removing the asking permission to use the mod in a video part. but if you do you will still have to credit the modder. this doesnt have to be a rule if everyone did it in the first place. I can absolutely live with that, but please do make that clear in the rule as well then. Something like "or follow the usage guidelines as stated in the mod's thread". That would be absolutely fine with me, just so long as it's clear from the get-go, especially to outsides.  The fact of letting each modders set his own rule IF THEY WANT is something me and the admins will consider. If a modder doesn't want his works attributed, that'ss his right . We will do an announcement after talking about it, and update the rules if needed Thank you, and to Titan as well. I know I'm bordering on pedantic with all of this, but I believe very strongly in this, as do you both. I don't believe most YouTubers who don't credit bear ill will, so for the community in general I would like this rule to be as practical as possible. And from a personal standpoint, I just want to know and have it be known that my mods' rules ultimately trump the global ones. |
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Post by The Mad Titan on Jun 7, 2015 1:06:58 GMT
its too complicated. if you want your mods to be not protected under it that is fine. there are some who think like that. But what you ask will make it too complicated and make youtubers and other modders confused too. because some people have trouble following basic instructions here. sad. but true. lol thats where having the global rule becomes an advantage. but like i said im gonna talk about removing the asking permission to use the mod in a video part. but if you do you will still have to credit the modder. this doesnt have to be a rule if everyone did it in the first place. I can absolutely live with that, but please do make that clear in the rule as well then. Something like "or follow the usage guidelines as stated in the mod's thread". That would be absolutely fine with me, just so long as it's clear from the get-go, especially to outsides. The fact of letting each modders set his own rule IF THEY WANT is something me and the admins will consider. If a modder doesn't want his works attributed, that'ss his right . We will do an announcement after talking about it, and update the rules if needed Thank you, and to Titan as well. I know I'm bordering on pedantic with all of this, but I believe very strongly in this, as do you both. I don't believe most YouTubers who don't credit bear ill will, so for the community in general I would like this rule to be as practical as possible. And from a personal standpoint, I just want to know and have it be known that my mods' rules ultimately trump the global ones. you can always make your own rule. we made this global rule to protect the modders. if you dont want that we dont force you . but other rules apply to you and this global rule applies to you if you use someone elses mod |
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Post by Xan on Jun 7, 2015 1:09:00 GMT
That's exactly my opinion about it. If you want to have your own rules, that's your choice. However the global rule still applies if the modder hasn't set his rules
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Post by Shenron on Jun 7, 2015 1:09:41 GMT
you can always make your own rule. we made this global rule to protect the modders. if you dont want that we dont force you . but other rules apply to you and this global rule applies to you if you use someone elses mod Of course, I purely meant one's own mods' ownership and usage rules. |
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Post by The Mad Titan on Jun 7, 2015 1:12:23 GMT
you can always make your own rule. we made this global rule to protect the modders. if you dont want that we dont force you . but other rules apply to you and this global rule applies to you if you use someone elses mod Of course, I purely meant one's own mods' ownership and usage rules. now i hope you ll behave from now on. now that we cleared it  you are gonna have to wait for mastaklo to come back to see the edit on the rule though. but you can just say i dont want credit for my mods in your thread in the beginning and it will override this rule specially for you |
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Post by Shenron on Jun 7, 2015 1:21:31 GMT
now i hope you ll behave from now on. now that we cleared it you are gonna have to wait for mastaklo to come back to see the edit on the rule though. but you can just say i dont want credit for my mods in your thread in the beginning and it will override this rule specially for you Hey, I stayed polite(ish)!  No but seriously, it just felt really frustrating, as I felt like I wasn't being taken seriously and that after my preparation work so far I wouldn't post any mods here. Apologies that I got a bit aggressive, but again, creative say and ownership is something really dear and close to my heart. =) |
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Post by The Mad Titan on Jun 7, 2015 1:28:43 GMT
now i hope you ll behave from now on. now that we cleared it you are gonna have to wait for mastaklo to come back to see the edit on the rule though. but you can just say i dont want credit for my mods in your thread in the beginning and it will override this rule specially for you Hey, I stayed polite(ish)! No but seriously, it just felt really frustrating, as I felt like I wasn't being taken seriously and that after my preparation work so far I wouldn't post any mods here. Apologies that I got a bit aggressive, but again, creative say and ownership is something really dear and close to my heart. =) i m always open to suggestions ... but you didn't specify that you only wanted your mods to be exempted from this. good thing xan intervened. |
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Post by Shenron on Jun 7, 2015 1:34:10 GMT
i m always open to suggestions ... but you didn't specify that you only wanted your mods to be exempted from this. good thing xan intervened. Yup, there was definitely some miscommunication there, apologies again. My reasoning however was that there might be more people who feel like me, and so "exception status" doesn't seem desirable. Blame it on my programmer mind, but exceptions can get unwieldly quickly. As long as it's clear people can opt-out, and for streamers e.g. that some mods may be exempt, I am one happy camper. |
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Post by The Mad Titan on Jun 7, 2015 1:48:40 GMT
i m always open to suggestions ... but you didn't specify that you only wanted your mods to be exempted from this. good thing xan intervened. Yup, there was definitely some miscommunication there, apologies again. My reasoning however was that there might be more people who feel like me, and so "exception status" doesn't seem desirable. Blame it on my programmer mind, but exceptions can get unwieldly quickly. As long as it's clear people can opt-out, and for streamers e.g. that some mods may be exempt, I am one happy camper. opting out is only for your own mods-for those you can have your own way of dealing with it , if you use another mod or do a showcase you still need to follow the rule. wording can be a huge issue in this case |
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Post by Shenron on Jun 7, 2015 1:54:05 GMT
opting out is only for your own mods-for those you can have your own way of dealing with it , if you use another mod or do a showcase you still need to follow the rule. wording can be a huge issue in this case Agreed, that's why I suggested an exception clause like "unless otherwise specified by that mod's ...". This would give precedence to the global rule, but leave room for individual exceptions. I'll await your decision for now though. =) |
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you are gonna have to wait for mastaklo to come back to see the edit on the rule though. but you can just say i dont want credit for my mods in your thread in the beginning and it will override this rule specially for you 
No but seriously, it just felt really frustrating, as I felt like I wasn't being taken seriously and that after my preparation work so far I wouldn't post any mods here. Apologies that I got a bit aggressive, but again, creative say and ownership is something really dear and close to my heart. =)