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Post by MasterJ360 on Jun 6, 2015 3:03:15 GMT
Reading this whole thread was a well spent 10 minutes. I have no regrets. Well done everyone! had to do that to him. sick bastard Well I mean before this got out of hand I downloaded many mods from here so I literally have a collection of personal favs from many modders So yea its going to be a pain for me to know who exactly created the specific mods Most of them are really old. So I link this community for others to check the site out. As for Download links I never post any without 1 on 1 permission unless the link goes directly to the creator himself. I had this issue when I was in the Smash Bros Community. So ever since then I stopped posting links all together even tho ppl begged for them. But yea its mainly the ones on youtube who create their own links especially with ads to generate revenue every time someone downloads them. So I feel the pain there |
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Post by The Mad Titan on Jun 6, 2015 3:14:06 GMT
had to do that to him. sick bastard Well I mean before this got out of hand I downloaded many mods from here so I literally have a collection of personal favs from many modders So yea its going to be a pain for me to know who exactly created the specific mods Most of them are really old. So I link this community for others to check the site out. As for Download links I never post any without 1 on 1 permission unless the link goes directly to the creator himself. I had this issue when I was in the Smash Bros Community. So ever since then I stopped posting links all together even tho ppl begged for them. But yea its mainly the ones on youtube who create their own links especially with ads to generate revenue every time someone downloads them. So I feel the pain there atleast link them from now on |
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Post by number0 on Jun 6, 2015 12:06:50 GMT
Looks like PS360HD2 links to this website now in his description
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Post by TheShadowGamerZ on Jun 6, 2015 21:36:27 GMT
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Post by Shenron on Jun 6, 2015 23:45:01 GMT
I understand the situation and since I'm a youtuber that happens to love use mods in various games I usually just post the forum community as a whole for credit I use and have alot of mods, so its a pain to re track every single individual for credit unless I upload the video right after I download a mod from them. Not everybody's intentions are steal mods by uploading for a showcase. If I had any time I would mod some stuff myself. gameplays are fine. you have to understand the point of the rule.this was to prevent unauthorized redestribution and uncredited mod showcases. modders spend a lot of time with their mods. and youtubers dont have a min to look it up and credit the modders? does that sound right for you? if you dont have time to mod why cant you credit the person you lets you have those mods for you to enjoy? is that so hard? for your record many of the youtubers share the modders link in their description. I'm gonna be a bit of a jerk here and say yes, it does sound right to me. It's not common behaviour to keep an up-to-date list of all the mods + creators and threads you have installed at any given time. Backtracking everything every single time can be extremely time-consuming and in the end, perhaps even not worth it. You mention that the point of the rule is what matters, so let's look at this realistically. Imho, the point is this: - Prevent people from blatantly claiming mods as their own.
- To make it easier for people to find the source of the mod.
I would argue that point B is the most important here. I also believe that people who want to use a specific mod they saw in a video are likely tech-savvy enough to find it, especially if the forum is mentioned or linked to. Making these requirements too strict, I fear, can lead to one or more of the following: - People not using or showcasing the mods, which would be a shame.
- People thinking "fuck it, too much hassle" and just using the mods regardless. They won't care if they get banned from here.
- People getting a bad impression of this place; thinking of the modders here as "the guys who make mods, but don't want us to use them!" or something to that effect.
And if you disagree and feel like full credits and linkbacks are always requires, fair enough, but I don't expect that to be the general concensus among modders (Yusion seemed to express a similar sentiment iirc, caring mostly about blatant stealing). In that case, I would suggest two things (lots of lists in this post): - A poll* to determine how modders feel about sharing and mod usage.
- Depending on the results of that poll, killing the rule and having each modder set their own rules in their own threads (my preference by far).
I think it's really important for this community to clarify this rule in a way that works best for most people. I've made my preference clear, but I think we desperately need some more input on this. Perhaps I'm wrong and everyone agrees with the rule as-is, or maybe it turns out most modders prefer individual rules as well. Whatever the outcome, the current vagueness is really detrimental imho. *Example poll: How do you think mods should be used and attributed?- Anyone sharing this mod, including gameplay footage, should credit me and my thread.
- Anyone sharing this mod, including gameplay footage, should credit DBXV.freeforums.net.
- Anyone sharing this mod, not including gameplay footage, should credit me and my thread.
- Anyone sharing this mod, not including gameplay footage, should credit DBXV.freeforums.net.
- No attribution should ever be required.
- I have my own set of rules I'd like to have users adhere to.
Quit edit, but this post illustrates why a global rule for this is a bad idea imo: Some people want these kind of links, others don't. It's just an inherently personal and case-by-case-variant issue. |
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Post by The Mad Titan on Jun 6, 2015 23:54:25 GMT
Shenron let me be clear. youtubers gain views from the things modders do for fun. the least they could do is to credit them. Notice the gameplay videos of BT3 mods? most have no links with them? so who made the mod? the youtuber? oh alright? he gets all the views thanks to a place one of his buddy told him, but he isnt gonna share because he doesnt want others to know. and i wanted to use those mods back then. but i couldnt find them. because i wasnt an insider. poeple hate change. but this change is for the good. If you can spend time on a video SURELY you can link the modder. this is a modding community.The rules are modder friendly. they dont have to be youtuber friendly. you have to understand that.This is all I have to say about this matter. P.S. -Im happy to see so many youtubers are adjusting to this. this is good for the modding community
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Post by Shenron on Jun 7, 2015 0:03:42 GMT
Shenron let me be clear. youtubers gain views from the things modders do for fun. the least they could do is to credit them. Notice the gameplay videos of BT3 mods? most have no links with them? so who made the mod? the youtuber? oh alright? he gets all the views thanks to a place one of his buddy told him, but he isnt gonna share because he doesnt want others to know. and i wanted to use those mods back then. but i couldnt find them. because i wasnt an insider. poeple hate change. but this change is for the good. If you can spend time on a video SURELY you can link the modder. this is a modding community.The rules are modder friendly. they dont have to be youtuber friendly. you have to understand that.This is all I have to say about this matter. P.S. -Im happy to see so many youtubers are adjusting to this. this is good for the modding community Sure, but from another perspective: YouTuber's aren't getting rich with this stuff either, and if a modder doesn't want their mod shared they don't have to post it. They could either keep it to themselves, or only PM it to trusted, interested parties. Yes, this is a modder community, but I think most modders make mods with the intention of them being used and seen. For this, YouTube and other content creators are vital. Without YouTube for example, I would never have even known about Project M. I already know we have completely opposing views on this, that's why I mentioned we desperately need more voices, either through a dedicated "how to handle this" thread or a poll of some sort. You can say "this is all I have to say about this matter", but I believe this is a decision that should be made by the community as a whole. Not a single moderator, or one or two outspoken members. |
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Post by The Mad Titan on Jun 7, 2015 0:17:20 GMT
Shenron let me be clear. youtubers gain views from the things modders do for fun. the least they could do is to credit them. Notice the gameplay videos of BT3 mods? most have no links with them? so who made the mod? the youtuber? oh alright? he gets all the views thanks to a place one of his buddy told him, but he isnt gonna share because he doesnt want others to know. and i wanted to use those mods back then. but i couldnt find them. because i wasnt an insider. poeple hate change. but this change is for the good. If you can spend time on a video SURELY you can link the modder. this is a modding community.The rules are modder friendly. they dont have to be youtuber friendly. you have to understand that.This is all I have to say about this matter. P.S. -Im happy to see so many youtubers are adjusting to this. this is good for the modding community Sure, but from another perspective: YouTuber's aren't getting rich with this stuff either, and if a modder doesn't want their mod shared they don't have to post it. They could either keep it to themselves, or only PM it to trusted, interested parties. Yes, this is a modder community, but I think most modders make mods with the intention of them being used and seen. For this, YouTube and other content creators are vital. Without YouTube for example, I would never have even known about Project M. I already know we have completely opposing views on this, that's why I mentioned we desperately need more voices, either through a dedicated "how to handle this" thread or a poll of some sort. You can say "this is all I have to say about this matter", but I believe this is a decision that should be made by the community as a whole. Not a single moderator, or one or two outspoken members. let me be simple and clear, if you have time to write that long messege and try to make a case why not try to credit the modder? is it so hard? does it cost you a bone or something? I have been rational about this. I want this community to grow. I could care less if the youtubers showcase this or not. in case they do its humane to credit the modder that they are getting views from. I have done so much for this community to grow, and all i want is this community to get the credit it deserve. simple as that. and im against your idea. altogether.Although i will change the wording eventually after talking to other moderators to remove the part" get permission to make a video" since its a bit of a hassle, |
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Post by Keno on Jun 7, 2015 0:20:07 GMT
gameplays are fine. you have to understand the point of the rule.this was to prevent unauthorized redestribution and uncredited mod showcases. modders spend a lot of time with their mods. and youtubers dont have a min to look it up and credit the modders? does that sound right for you? if you dont have time to mod why cant you credit the person you lets you have those mods for you to enjoy? is that so hard? for your record many of the youtubers share the modders link in their description. I'm gonna be a bit of a jerk here and say yes, it does sound right to me. It's not common behaviour to keep an up-to-date list of all the mods + creators and threads you have installed at any given time. Backtracking everything every single time can be extremely time-consuming and in the end, perhaps even not worth it. You mention that the point of the rule is what matters, so let's look at this realistically. Imho, the point is this: - Prevent people from blatantly claiming mods as their own.
- To make it easier for people to find the source of the mod.
I would argue that point B is the most important here. I also believe that people who want to use a specific mod they saw in a video are likely tech-savvy enough to find it, especially if the forum is mentioned or linked to. Making these requirements too strict, I fear, can lead to one or more of the following: - People not using or showcasing the mods, which would be a shame.
- People thinking "fuck it, too much hassle" and just using the mods regardless. They won't care if they get banned from here.
- People getting a bad impression of this place; thinking of the modders here as "the guys who make mods, but don't want us to use them!" or something to that effect.
And if you disagree and feel like full credits and linkbacks are always requires, fair enough, but I don't expect that to be the general concensus among modders (Yusion seemed to express a similar sentiment iirc, caring mostly about blatant stealing). In that case, I would suggest two things (lots of lists in this post): - A poll* to determine how modders feel about sharing and mod usage.
- Depending on the results of that poll, killing the rule and having each modder set their own rules in their own threads (my preference by far).
I think it's really important for this community to clarify this rule in a way that works best for most people. I've made my preference clear, but I think we desperately need some more input on this. Perhaps I'm wrong and everyone agrees with the rule as-is, or maybe it turns out most modders prefer individual rules as well. Whatever the outcome, the current vagueness is really detrimental imho. *Example poll: How do you think mods should be used and attributed?- Anyone sharing this mod, including gameplay footage, should credit me and my thread.
- Anyone sharing this mod, including gameplay footage, should credit DBXV.freeforums.net.
- Anyone sharing this mod, not including gameplay footage, should credit me and my thread.
- Anyone sharing this mod, not including gameplay footage, should credit DBXV.freeforums.net.
- No attribution should ever be required.
- I have my own set of rules I'd like to have users adhere to.
Quit edit, but this post illustrates why a global rule for this is a bad idea imo: Some people want these kind of links, others don't. It's just an inherently personal and case-by-case-variant issue. All that typing you just did was irrelevant, at the end of the day modders deserve credit for their work it's that simple... not sure why this is even becoming a problem i guess people are too lazy to give credit. |
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Post by Shenron on Jun 7, 2015 0:27:05 GMT
Because I don't make videos. If I did, yes, I would absolutely credit.
So have I. The thing is, you think that credit absolutely needs to be given, and that is totally fair. But you are deciding for all of us. I have a Bra model I could fairly easily turn into a mod. If I do that though, right now, I would not feel comfortable uploading my mod here, as I wouldn't require attribution. You are all for mod ownership, but in the meantime are setting a global precedent for all the mods listed here.
Look, I respect all the work you're putting in here, as well as your desire for this community to grow. But by deciding on mod usage for everyone here, and refusing to even ask for feedback you are not helping the community; you're ruling it. I've never been part of a modding community, for all I know my views are unique. But why do you refuse to even hear what others think? Where's the harm in that? If anything, please reply to this last question.
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Post by Shenron on Jun 7, 2015 0:29:53 GMT
Shenron All that typing you just did was irrelevant, at the end of the day modders deserve credit for their work it's that simple... not sure why this is even becoming a problem i guess people are too lazy to give credit. See my previous post. Modders do deserve credit if they so desire. Personally, I wouldn't, especially just for gameplay footage. |
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Post by The Mad Titan on Jun 7, 2015 0:33:39 GMT
Because I don't make videos. If I did, yes, I would absolutely credit. So have I. The thing is, you think that credit absolutely needs to be given, and that is totally fair. But you are deciding for all of us. I have a Bra model I could fairly easily turn into a mod. If I do that though, right now, I would not feel comfortable uploading my mod here, as I wouldn't require attribution. You are all for mod ownership, but in the meantime are setting a global precedent for all the mods listed here. Look, I respect all the work you're putting in here, as well as your desire for this community to grow. But by deciding on mod usage for everyone here, and refusing to even ask for feedback you are not helping the community; you're ruling it. I've never been part of a modding community, for all I know my views are unique. But why do you refuse to even hear what others think? Where's the harm in that? If anything, please reply to this last question. the thing is im more active than you are. And i know there are people who are backing me up on this. Im not ruling. no one here is. your plea is really pointless to even bother with a poll because i already know most modders want credit for their work. and that is the answer to your last question. |
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Post by The Mad Titan on Jun 7, 2015 0:35:16 GMT
Shenron All that typing you just did was irrelevant, at the end of the day modders deserve credit for their work it's that simple... not sure why this is even becoming a problem i guess people are too lazy to give credit. See my previous post. Modders do deserve credit if they so desire. Personally, I wouldn't, especially just for gameplay footage. i feel that you have trouble reading my comments at times. today i began to wonder if this is the same person who agreed with me a few days ago on the same topic. at this point I will not respond to this thread anymore. |
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Post by Shenron on Jun 7, 2015 0:42:03 GMT
But I'm not asking if most modders want credit for their work, I'm asking if modders are okay with a global attribution rule or would prefer to state their own. Let's say 60% of modders would not want their models used, even with credit, for rule34 works. Should this then become a global rule? Or should we leave it up to each individual modder?
I was really hoping to become an active member and start posting some stuff soon; it's why I re-installed Windows and created that Bra model. All I'm saying is this current rule is off-putting to me, and I would likely not post my mods here as a result. I think more people might feel the same way, hence my request for a simple poll.
I'm 100% certain there will be a number of people agreeing with you. But I'm not sure that 100% of people will agree with you. I know I haven't contributed yet, but I was hoping my voice would at least count for something. However, I'm beginning to think suggestions are not appreciated and I just have to either accept it as it is or leave, which would be a shame imho.
EDIT:
I still agree it was a good call to make at the time, but I also think it's not a good long-term solution. I also agree we're somewhat arguing past eachother, which is again why I suggested adding more voices into the mix. I'm sorry you feel this way.
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Post by Xan on Jun 7, 2015 0:46:51 GMT
We are always taking up suggestions, but as for mods credits , I don't think it should be removed.
If some of the modders would not want their models used, why whould he post here ? I might misunderstand you, but what is clearly your suggestions ? not giving credits to modders ?
I have some trouble following you
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